On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 20:39:31 GMT, Wolfgang Pawlinetz <mille@afm.at>
wrote:

>JP Roberts wrote:
>
>>are the rare exceptions. But with a few exceptions like that of Wolfgang, I
>>think it's the make's policy that's faulty. If you doubt what I'm saying I
>>would like you to point me out to just a couple of links in which our make
>>has covered something after the guarantee had expired.
>
>Have you read the links I looked up for you as far as other brands are
>concerned?
>
>In your (understandable) bitterness you are now trying to ask for the
>impossible. As has been discussed numerous times, the folks who got
>their Audi serviced properly, quickly and who were taken care of have
>absolutely no inclination to write that down.

Allow me to praise my dealer (which I think I've done in this space:
John Holtz Audi in Rochester, NY). They've never ripped me off.
They've given me good advice and diagnoses. However, I have not
always (or often, for that matter) gone to them for major service work
because their prices are so much higher than the two independent shops
I can choose from locally. And those shops also do great jobs with
Audi and other Kraut import cars.

Back to the dealer: they're forthright about their prices, and my
market bears them, but I don't participate, that's all, beyond the
routine oil change for the most part. And they're still very good in
the customer care department. I value their involvement in the care
of my 1998 2.8 A4 Quattro.

Unfortunately, I've gotta replace some control arms on the front
passenger corner, at 86k miles, but that's life with an Audi, and I
still feel I'm coming out way ahead valuewise. This paid-off car is
still cheaper for me to run than a new car with payments, and I love
the whole driving experience with it. I'll be going to Universal
Imports for this work, I think, which will cost me half of what Holtz
would charge. But I do like CDI out in Victor, too.

 

On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 20:39:31 GMT, Wolfgang Pawlinetz <mille@afm.at>
wrote:

>JP Roberts wrote:
>
>>are the rare exceptions. But with a few exceptions like that of Wolfgang, I
>>think it's the make's policy that's faulty. If you doubt what I'm saying I
>>would like you to point me out to just a couple of links in which our make
>>has covered something after the guarantee had expired.
>
>Have you read the links I looked up for you as far as other brands are
>concerned?
>
>In your (understandable) bitterness you are now trying to ask for the
>impossible. As has been discussed numerous times, the folks who got
>their Audi serviced properly, quickly and who were taken care of have
>absolutely no inclination to write that down.

Allow me to praise my dealer (which I think I've done in this space:
John Holtz Audi in Rochester, NY). They've never ripped me off.
They've given me good advice and diagnoses. However, I have not
always (or often, for that matter) gone to them for major service work
because their prices are so much higher than the two independent shops
I can choose from locally. And those shops also do great jobs with
Audi and other Kraut import cars.

Back to the dealer: they're forthright about their prices, and my
market bears them, but I don't participate, that's all, beyond the
routine oil change for the most part. And they're still very good in
the customer care department. I value their involvement in the care
of my 1998 2.8 A4 Quattro.

Unfortunately, I've gotta replace some control arms on the front
passenger corner, at 86k miles, but that's life with an Audi, and I
still feel I'm coming out way ahead valuewise. This paid-off car is
still cheaper for me to run than a new car with payments, and I love
the whole driving experience with it. I'll be going to Universal
Imports for this work, I think, which will cost me half of what Holtz
would charge. But I do like CDI out in Victor, too.

 

On Thu, 21 Apr 2005 20:39:31 GMT, Wolfgang Pawlinetz <mille@afm.at>
wrote:

>JP Roberts wrote:
>
>>are the rare exceptions. But with a few exceptions like that of Wolfgang, I
>>think it's the make's policy that's faulty. If you doubt what I'm saying I
>>would like you to point me out to just a couple of links in which our make
>>has covered something after the guarantee had expired.
>
>Have you read the links I looked up for you as far as other brands are
>concerned?
>
>In your (understandable) bitterness you are now trying to ask for the
>impossible. As has been discussed numerous times, the folks who got
>their Audi serviced properly, quickly and who were taken care of have
>absolutely no inclination to write that down.

Allow me to praise my dealer (which I think I've done in this space:
John Holtz Audi in Rochester, NY). They've never ripped me off.
They've given me good advice and diagnoses. However, I have not
always (or often, for that matter) gone to them for major service work
because their prices are so much higher than the two independent shops
I can choose from locally. And those shops also do great jobs with
Audi and other Kraut import cars.

Back to the dealer: they're forthright about their prices, and my
market bears them, but I don't participate, that's all, beyond the
routine oil change for the most part. And they're still very good in
the customer care department. I value their involvement in the care
of my 1998 2.8 A4 Quattro.

Unfortunately, I've gotta replace some control arms on the front
passenger corner, at 86k miles, but that's life with an Audi, and I
still feel I'm coming out way ahead valuewise. This paid-off car is
still cheaper for me to run than a new car with payments, and I love
the whole driving experience with it. I'll be going to Universal
Imports for this work, I think, which will cost me half of what Holtz
would charge. But I do like CDI out in Victor, too.

 

Wolfgang, did you read my reply to those links posted above?
>
> Have you read the links I looked up for you as far as other brands are
> concerned?

These are still a minority when it comes down to general satisfaction with
the treatment received. Just do a search in Audiworld.
> In your (understandable) bitterness you are now trying to ask for the
> impossible. As has been discussed numerous times, the folks who got
> their Audi serviced properly, quickly and who were taken care of have
> absolutely no inclination to write that down.

There's no denying that these newsgroup is a valuable asset, but no matter
how impressive your figures are, you're neglecting the fact that the vast
majority of Audi Owners will never take to the internet to vent their
frustrations with the make out.
> The Audi Group delivered 1.2 Million units to customers in 2004 and
> 2003. Volkswagen as a total 5 Million Units per year worldwide. How
> many posts does Audiworld have which are that negative? How many
> posters show up here every month to ask for some help? 10? 20?

I'm seriously considering BMW as my next buy.
> But I can only meanwhile recommend the same as other posters: Go and
> get another brand?
>
> Regards
>
> Wolfgang
>
> --
> 1999 Audi A6 Avant TDI

 

Wolfgang, did you read my reply to those links posted above?
>
> Have you read the links I looked up for you as far as other brands are
> concerned?

These are still a minority when it comes down to general satisfaction with
the treatment received. Just do a search in Audiworld.
> In your (understandable) bitterness you are now trying to ask for the
> impossible. As has been discussed numerous times, the folks who got
> their Audi serviced properly, quickly and who were taken care of have
> absolutely no inclination to write that down.

There's no denying that these newsgroup is a valuable asset, but no matter
how impressive your figures are, you're neglecting the fact that the vast
majority of Audi Owners will never take to the internet to vent their
frustrations with the make out.
> The Audi Group delivered 1.2 Million units to customers in 2004 and
> 2003. Volkswagen as a total 5 Million Units per year worldwide. How
> many posts does Audiworld have which are that negative? How many
> posters show up here every month to ask for some help? 10? 20?

I'm seriously considering BMW as my next buy.
> But I can only meanwhile recommend the same as other posters: Go and
> get another brand?
>
> Regards
>
> Wolfgang
>
> --
> 1999 Audi A6 Avant TDI

 

Wolfgang, did you read my reply to those links posted above?
>
> Have you read the links I looked up for you as far as other brands are
> concerned?

These are still a minority when it comes down to general satisfaction with
the treatment received. Just do a search in Audiworld.
> In your (understandable) bitterness you are now trying to ask for the
> impossible. As has been discussed numerous times, the folks who got
> their Audi serviced properly, quickly and who were taken care of have
> absolutely no inclination to write that down.

There's no denying that these newsgroup is a valuable asset, but no matter
how impressive your figures are, you're neglecting the fact that the vast
majority of Audi Owners will never take to the internet to vent their
frustrations with the make out.
> The Audi Group delivered 1.2 Million units to customers in 2004 and
> 2003. Volkswagen as a total 5 Million Units per year worldwide. How
> many posts does Audiworld have which are that negative? How many
> posters show up here every month to ask for some help? 10? 20?

I'm seriously considering BMW as my next buy.
> But I can only meanwhile recommend the same as other posters: Go and
> get another brand?
>
> Regards
>
> Wolfgang
>
> --
> 1999 Audi A6 Avant TDI

 

You very well know it was not a one-week notice period, but at least a
couple of months that we're talking about, so yes, just about every other
manufacturer could have done so easily.
> At the time of VAG's coil pack problem, how many manufacturers could
> have supplied, at a one-week notice, a batch of one hundred of those
> specified coil packs?
>
>> So, it's nothing a
>> couple more bucks investment couldn't have solved in an instant.

You know one of the virtues in life is that of showing some flexibility?
Again, where's your link showing our make covering something out of
warranty?
> Then why bother having a warranty period, hmmm? If it breaks, we'll
> fix it, no matter how old the car? No matter what mileage, no matter
> what sort of abuse or modification? OK, so that's the silly extreme,
> but there does have to be a line drawn somewhere. You happened to fall
> on the other side of it, and your dealership is taking a hard line and
> saying "tough luck."
>

You're right it's only your guess, which happens to be wrong.
> You admit you're not an automotive engineer, so in this case I guess I
> really am right. Making your "clear case" comment is just so much
> prattling on.
>
>> Also, upon inspection deterioration is so obvious that there's no
> denying
>> the bad engineering.

Let me put it this way, when you see you're bleeding badly, do you need to
be a cardiovascular doctor to know if there's something seriously wrong?
Even a child would understand something like this.
> Except you're not an automotive engineer, so your "inspection" is
> meaningless. A few stories and some hearsay from some folks who have a
> monetary interest in getting your car on a hoist is not evidence. I
> suppose in your courses of study in engineering you had to take some
> classes in real, hard sciences, right? You can tell the difference
> between hard and anecdotal data, yes?

I've long been questioning yours, as you fail to maintain a logical argument
by slightly diverting from the main topic all the time.
> All the more reason to name this dealer. Because now it's *your*
> credibility that I'm questioning. Normally, I give the benefit of the
> doubt to the customer, and assume the dealer is the problem. Now I'm
> beginning to get another idea in your specific case.
>
This thread, but just conduct a search in Audiworld.
>> I would dare to say that the good stories
>> are the rare exceptions.
>
> Why? I've heard of more good stories in this thread than bad.
>

Again, you're failing to remember that it's a case of underengineering, so
another reason why your own credibility is close to nil.
> LOL. You think the car should come with some all-inclusive lifetime
> warranty for everything, including stuff that other people have had
> replaced under warranty.
>

 

You very well know it was not a one-week notice period, but at least a
couple of months that we're talking about, so yes, just about every other
manufacturer could have done so easily.
> At the time of VAG's coil pack problem, how many manufacturers could
> have supplied, at a one-week notice, a batch of one hundred of those
> specified coil packs?
>
>> So, it's nothing a
>> couple more bucks investment couldn't have solved in an instant.

You know one of the virtues in life is that of showing some flexibility?
Again, where's your link showing our make covering something out of
warranty?
> Then why bother having a warranty period, hmmm? If it breaks, we'll
> fix it, no matter how old the car? No matter what mileage, no matter
> what sort of abuse or modification? OK, so that's the silly extreme,
> but there does have to be a line drawn somewhere. You happened to fall
> on the other side of it, and your dealership is taking a hard line and
> saying "tough luck."
>

You're right it's only your guess, which happens to be wrong.
> You admit you're not an automotive engineer, so in this case I guess I
> really am right. Making your "clear case" comment is just so much
> prattling on.
>
>> Also, upon inspection deterioration is so obvious that there's no
> denying
>> the bad engineering.

Let me put it this way, when you see you're bleeding badly, do you need to
be a cardiovascular doctor to know if there's something seriously wrong?
Even a child would understand something like this.
> Except you're not an automotive engineer, so your "inspection" is
> meaningless. A few stories and some hearsay from some folks who have a
> monetary interest in getting your car on a hoist is not evidence. I
> suppose in your courses of study in engineering you had to take some
> classes in real, hard sciences, right? You can tell the difference
> between hard and anecdotal data, yes?

I've long been questioning yours, as you fail to maintain a logical argument
by slightly diverting from the main topic all the time.
> All the more reason to name this dealer. Because now it's *your*
> credibility that I'm questioning. Normally, I give the benefit of the
> doubt to the customer, and assume the dealer is the problem. Now I'm
> beginning to get another idea in your specific case.
>
This thread, but just conduct a search in Audiworld.
>> I would dare to say that the good stories
>> are the rare exceptions.
>
> Why? I've heard of more good stories in this thread than bad.
>

Again, you're failing to remember that it's a case of underengineering, so
another reason why your own credibility is close to nil.
> LOL. You think the car should come with some all-inclusive lifetime
> warranty for everything, including stuff that other people have had
> replaced under warranty.
>

 

You very well know it was not a one-week notice period, but at least a
couple of months that we're talking about, so yes, just about every other
manufacturer could have done so easily.
> At the time of VAG's coil pack problem, how many manufacturers could
> have supplied, at a one-week notice, a batch of one hundred of those
> specified coil packs?
>
>> So, it's nothing a
>> couple more bucks investment couldn't have solved in an instant.

You know one of the virtues in life is that of showing some flexibility?
Again, where's your link showing our make covering something out of
warranty?
> Then why bother having a warranty period, hmmm? If it breaks, we'll
> fix it, no matter how old the car? No matter what mileage, no matter
> what sort of abuse or modification? OK, so that's the silly extreme,
> but there does have to be a line drawn somewhere. You happened to fall
> on the other side of it, and your dealership is taking a hard line and
> saying "tough luck."
>

You're right it's only your guess, which happens to be wrong.
> You admit you're not an automotive engineer, so in this case I guess I
> really am right. Making your "clear case" comment is just so much
> prattling on.
>
>> Also, upon inspection deterioration is so obvious that there's no
> denying
>> the bad engineering.

Let me put it this way, when you see you're bleeding badly, do you need to
be a cardiovascular doctor to know if there's something seriously wrong?
Even a child would understand something like this.
> Except you're not an automotive engineer, so your "inspection" is
> meaningless. A few stories and some hearsay from some folks who have a
> monetary interest in getting your car on a hoist is not evidence. I
> suppose in your courses of study in engineering you had to take some
> classes in real, hard sciences, right? You can tell the difference
> between hard and anecdotal data, yes?

I've long been questioning yours, as you fail to maintain a logical argument
by slightly diverting from the main topic all the time.
> All the more reason to name this dealer. Because now it's *your*
> credibility that I'm questioning. Normally, I give the benefit of the
> doubt to the customer, and assume the dealer is the problem. Now I'm
> beginning to get another idea in your specific case.
>
This thread, but just conduct a search in Audiworld.
>> I would dare to say that the good stories
>> are the rare exceptions.
>
> Why? I've heard of more good stories in this thread than bad.
>

Again, you're failing to remember that it's a case of underengineering, so
another reason why your own credibility is close to nil.
> LOL. You think the car should come with some all-inclusive lifetime
> warranty for everything, including stuff that other people have had
> replaced under warranty.
>

 

In message <d4b6e7$tkm$2@news.ya.com>
"JP Roberts" <1234@yahoo.com> wrote:

[Snip]

> Again, where's your link showing our make covering something out of
> warranty?

The only fault which has affected the drivability any of our Audis, in a
total 11.5 years of ownership was when a fuel injector failed on my 1996
A4 2.6. It failed about 2 months out of warranty but Audi UK covered
the repair at no cost to me.

--
Peter Bell (Note Spamtrap - To reply, replace 'invalid' with 'bellfamily')