brnelson55@yahoo.com

I currently have 38,000 miles on my 03 A4 Quattro and noticed that my
clutch is slipping when I change gears. Basically my RPMs are way too
high for my acceleration and speed when I shift into gear. I've also
noticed that it seems to stick a little when I shift into 2nd gear.
The realease point is extremely high as well. If the mechanic noticed
that the release point seemed different.

The dealership says that if the wear is due to abuse then I will have
to pay a minimum of $500 just for them to look at the clutch and
$2300!!! to replace it. My car is under warranty and I think this is
bullsh$t. I do not drop my clutch at rpms, constantly keep it in
engaged, nor do I race it all the time. I live in Atlanta with
terrible traffic and have to shift a lot in bumper to bumper traffic
and I shift slowly for smooth shifts but am wondering if that is
actually worse for the clutch than quick jerky shifts since the clutch
is engaged longer. They also tried to tell me that because I have 19"
RS6 wheels that the circumfrence and weight of the new wheel is similar
to "towing a boat" which is more stressful on the clutch. Am i wrong or
is the diameter the same since the profile of the tire is smaller to
compensate for the bigger wheel. Also, what added weight? I know he
can't possibly mean actual lbs added to the car.

Finally they said abuse can be identified by rippped rivets, excessive
hot spots, and uneven wear on the clutch. Can anyone verify that this
can identify abuse?? Is there a difference in how the clutch looks
based on whether I'm racing the car or shifting much more than normal
due to traffic conditions? Can anyone give me any information to form
a solid argument with them? I am not a mechanic but I refuse to be
taken advantage of by these dealerships any longer

Steve Sears

BR,
The dealership will always try to find a reason for not running a warranty
repair, especially a clutch replacement. I'm sure that you don't track your
car, but there are people that do, and they certainly should not be given a
free clutch for trying to outpace a Corvette on the local strip.
That said, the diameter of your rims has little to do with the wear on your
clutch. If you were running monster truck tires then it certainly would
(~72" rims?), but the rolling diameter of any given tire and rim combination
should be close to stock, otherwise your speedometer/odometer would be
wrong. This comment smacks of "grasping at straws", and suggests that they
are really trying to weasel out of the repair.
I would try taking the car to a different dealer, and take your business to
the new shop in the future. Ask around on Audiworld for shop
recommendations, and make sure you post which shop fed you the line of "rim
diameter related clutch damage" bunk. I'd also ask for the parts they take
out of the car to be put in a box in the trunk, so that you.....and your
lawyer's experts.....can look at the damaged parts (wink wink). They've
sold you a car with a warranty - now they have to show what the warranty is
for.
Cheers!
Steve Sears
1987 Audi 5kTQ
1980 Audi 5k
1962 and '64 Auto Union DKW Junior deLuxes
(SPAM Blocker NOTE: Remove SHOES to reply)

<brnelson55@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1146623693.544587.106700@u72g2000cwu.googlegr oups.com...
>I currently have 38,000 miles on my 03 A4 Quattro and noticed that my
> clutch is slipping when I change gears. Basically my RPMs are way too
> high for my acceleration and speed when I shift into gear. I've also
> noticed that it seems to stick a little when I shift into 2nd gear.
> The realease point is extremely high as well. If the mechanic noticed
> that the release point seemed different.
>
> The dealership says that if the wear is due to abuse then I will have
> to pay a minimum of $500 just for them to look at the clutch and
> $2300!!! to replace it. My car is under warranty and I think this is
> bullsh$t. I do not drop my clutch at rpms, constantly keep it in
> engaged, nor do I race it all the time. I live in Atlanta with
> terrible traffic and have to shift a lot in bumper to bumper traffic
> and I shift slowly for smooth shifts but am wondering if that is
> actually worse for the clutch than quick jerky shifts since the clutch
> is engaged longer. They also tried to tell me that because I have 19"
> RS6 wheels that the circumfrence and weight of the new wheel is similar
> to "towing a boat" which is more stressful on the clutch. Am i wrong or
> is the diameter the same since the profile of the tire is smaller to
> compensate for the bigger wheel. Also, what added weight? I know he
> can't possibly mean actual lbs added to the car.
>
> Finally they said abuse can be identified by rippped rivets, excessive
> hot spots, and uneven wear on the clutch. Can anyone verify that this
> can identify abuse?? Is there a difference in how the clutch looks
> based on whether I'm racing the car or shifting much more than normal
> due to traffic conditions? Can anyone give me any information to form
> a solid argument with them? I am not a mechanic but I refuse to be
> taken advantage of by these dealerships any longer
>

Steve Sears

BR,
The dealership will always try to find a reason for not running a warranty
repair, especially a clutch replacement. I'm sure that you don't track your
car, but there are people that do, and they certainly should not be given a
free clutch for trying to outpace a Corvette on the local strip.
That said, the diameter of your rims has little to do with the wear on your
clutch. If you were running monster truck tires then it certainly would
(~72" rims?), but the rolling diameter of any given tire and rim combination
should be close to stock, otherwise your speedometer/odometer would be
wrong. This comment smacks of "grasping at straws", and suggests that they
are really trying to weasel out of the repair.
I would try taking the car to a different dealer, and take your business to
the new shop in the future. Ask around on Audiworld for shop
recommendations, and make sure you post which shop fed you the line of "rim
diameter related clutch damage" bunk. I'd also ask for the parts they take
out of the car to be put in a box in the trunk, so that you.....and your
lawyer's experts.....can look at the damaged parts (wink wink). They've
sold you a car with a warranty - now they have to show what the warranty is
for.
Cheers!
Steve Sears
1987 Audi 5kTQ
1980 Audi 5k
1962 and '64 Auto Union DKW Junior deLuxes
(SPAM Blocker NOTE: Remove SHOES to reply)

<brnelson55@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1146623693.544587.106700@u72g2000cwu.googlegr oups.com...
>I currently have 38,000 miles on my 03 A4 Quattro and noticed that my
> clutch is slipping when I change gears. Basically my RPMs are way too
> high for my acceleration and speed when I shift into gear. I've also
> noticed that it seems to stick a little when I shift into 2nd gear.
> The realease point is extremely high as well. If the mechanic noticed
> that the release point seemed different.
>
> The dealership says that if the wear is due to abuse then I will have
> to pay a minimum of $500 just for them to look at the clutch and
> $2300!!! to replace it. My car is under warranty and I think this is
> bullsh$t. I do not drop my clutch at rpms, constantly keep it in
> engaged, nor do I race it all the time. I live in Atlanta with
> terrible traffic and have to shift a lot in bumper to bumper traffic
> and I shift slowly for smooth shifts but am wondering if that is
> actually worse for the clutch than quick jerky shifts since the clutch
> is engaged longer. They also tried to tell me that because I have 19"
> RS6 wheels that the circumfrence and weight of the new wheel is similar
> to "towing a boat" which is more stressful on the clutch. Am i wrong or
> is the diameter the same since the profile of the tire is smaller to
> compensate for the bigger wheel. Also, what added weight? I know he
> can't possibly mean actual lbs added to the car.
>
> Finally they said abuse can be identified by rippped rivets, excessive
> hot spots, and uneven wear on the clutch. Can anyone verify that this
> can identify abuse?? Is there a difference in how the clutch looks
> based on whether I'm racing the car or shifting much more than normal
> due to traffic conditions? Can anyone give me any information to form
> a solid argument with them? I am not a mechanic but I refuse to be
> taken advantage of by these dealerships any longer
>

Steve Sears

BR,
The dealership will always try to find a reason for not running a warranty
repair, especially a clutch replacement. I'm sure that you don't track your
car, but there are people that do, and they certainly should not be given a
free clutch for trying to outpace a Corvette on the local strip.
That said, the diameter of your rims has little to do with the wear on your
clutch. If you were running monster truck tires then it certainly would
(~72" rims?), but the rolling diameter of any given tire and rim combination
should be close to stock, otherwise your speedometer/odometer would be
wrong. This comment smacks of "grasping at straws", and suggests that they
are really trying to weasel out of the repair.
I would try taking the car to a different dealer, and take your business to
the new shop in the future. Ask around on Audiworld for shop
recommendations, and make sure you post which shop fed you the line of "rim
diameter related clutch damage" bunk. I'd also ask for the parts they take
out of the car to be put in a box in the trunk, so that you.....and your
lawyer's experts.....can look at the damaged parts (wink wink). They've
sold you a car with a warranty - now they have to show what the warranty is
for.
Cheers!
Steve Sears
1987 Audi 5kTQ
1980 Audi 5k
1962 and '64 Auto Union DKW Junior deLuxes
(SPAM Blocker NOTE: Remove SHOES to reply)

<brnelson55@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1146623693.544587.106700@u72g2000cwu.googlegr oups.com...
>I currently have 38,000 miles on my 03 A4 Quattro and noticed that my
> clutch is slipping when I change gears. Basically my RPMs are way too
> high for my acceleration and speed when I shift into gear. I've also
> noticed that it seems to stick a little when I shift into 2nd gear.
> The realease point is extremely high as well. If the mechanic noticed
> that the release point seemed different.
>
> The dealership says that if the wear is due to abuse then I will have
> to pay a minimum of $500 just for them to look at the clutch and
> $2300!!! to replace it. My car is under warranty and I think this is
> bullsh$t. I do not drop my clutch at rpms, constantly keep it in
> engaged, nor do I race it all the time. I live in Atlanta with
> terrible traffic and have to shift a lot in bumper to bumper traffic
> and I shift slowly for smooth shifts but am wondering if that is
> actually worse for the clutch than quick jerky shifts since the clutch
> is engaged longer. They also tried to tell me that because I have 19"
> RS6 wheels that the circumfrence and weight of the new wheel is similar
> to "towing a boat" which is more stressful on the clutch. Am i wrong or
> is the diameter the same since the profile of the tire is smaller to
> compensate for the bigger wheel. Also, what added weight? I know he
> can't possibly mean actual lbs added to the car.
>
> Finally they said abuse can be identified by rippped rivets, excessive
> hot spots, and uneven wear on the clutch. Can anyone verify that this
> can identify abuse?? Is there a difference in how the clutch looks
> based on whether I'm racing the car or shifting much more than normal
> due to traffic conditions? Can anyone give me any information to form
> a solid argument with them? I am not a mechanic but I refuse to be
> taken advantage of by these dealerships any longer
>

winston

Here's what I think you ought to consider in terms of variables and
taking control of this particular situation...

Assuming you bought the car new and the warranty is a new car warranty,
it will be unlikely that a worn out clutch will be covered under
warranty, because (read your fine print to check on this) "wear items"
like tires, clutch and brake linings are not usually covered by car
manufacturer warranties.

If your clutch has simply worn out after 38K that's surely odd...but
hey, maybe you're riding the clutch and you sent it to an early
grave...obviously nobody here can say one way or the other. My 87 5ktq
has 250K on the original clutch and it's solid...my BMW 3 series took
220K of whipping, and I mean a daily thrashing, by me before it toasted
not the lining, but the throw bearing.....German cars have very good
clutches, so you're either riding the clutch, abusing it, or it's
defective. Common sense says it's 1 of those 3 possibilities.

The 2 usual exceptions to the general rule in new car Warranty coverage
that will get your clutch fixed for free are:

1. manufacturers defects; and

2. the existence of "service memos", those semi-secret
manufacturer-to-dealer advisories which identify known premature or
oddball problems. (for example, my mom's '99 Caddy STS had a free valve
job done on its Northstar 32 Valve V8 at 120,000km...big
cash!...because of a Service Memo I tracked down online).

As for the stealer, er, I mean dealer...factory-authorized warranty
jobs pay Top Dollar my friend...I haven't met a dealer yet that doesn't
want to find a way to get the factory to pay full pop for a nice payday
like an Audi clutch. That's my way of saying there's nothing in it for
the dealer to try and get you to pay for it if they can get the factory
cash in their hands....unless they plan on double-dipping and getting
money from you and the factory, but that's risky business, as a dealer
can lose its franchise if it gets caught doing fraudulent warranty
claims....

So unless your dealer is exceptionally well-known as a weaselarium or
you've heard rumours they're about to go under, I'd tend to steer
towards getting the dealer to involve your Zone/Regional Audi office in
the teardown...or call them yourself....manufacturers such as Audi have
people on the road that inspect unusual or pricey potential warranty
claims and make fair rulings in my experience. Plus, having the Zone
rep involved will keep the dealer honest.

My wierdest clutch experience:

In the early 1980's I went through a Renault Phase and after owning an
R5 GTL and an Encore, I bought a 2 year old Fuego Turbo from a Ford
dealer....and paid extra to get the Ford Red Carpet Used Car
Warranty...because I knew Fuegos were cool, but extremely nasty cars to
repair.

The clutch started slipping within a week....no problem, they changed
it no charge.

A month later, it went again. They changed it, no problem, no charge.

A few months later, I picked it up with Clutch #5 in it and got 10
minutes away from the dealership, hit the highway, put it in fourth at
about 4500 RPM and jumped on the gas to get the big Garrett T3 to blast
off.....wheeeeeeeeee.....clutch gone again.

The dealer then told me I obviously was "racing" and "abusing" the
car....in ten minutes!

Long story cut short....the Ford Zone Rep gave me a bag of cash to make
me go away.

Turned out it was a cracked bell housing leaking fluid on the clutch
material.

Maybe your transmission case has a hairline crack...if so, your clutch
material will be wet.

Good luck!

winston

Here's what I think you ought to consider in terms of variables and
taking control of this particular situation...

Assuming you bought the car new and the warranty is a new car warranty,
it will be unlikely that a worn out clutch will be covered under
warranty, because (read your fine print to check on this) "wear items"
like tires, clutch and brake linings are not usually covered by car
manufacturer warranties.

If your clutch has simply worn out after 38K that's surely odd...but
hey, maybe you're riding the clutch and you sent it to an early
grave...obviously nobody here can say one way or the other. My 87 5ktq
has 250K on the original clutch and it's solid...my BMW 3 series took
220K of whipping, and I mean a daily thrashing, by me before it toasted
not the lining, but the throw bearing.....German cars have very good
clutches, so you're either riding the clutch, abusing it, or it's
defective. Common sense says it's 1 of those 3 possibilities.

The 2 usual exceptions to the general rule in new car Warranty coverage
that will get your clutch fixed for free are:

1. manufacturers defects; and

2. the existence of "service memos", those semi-secret
manufacturer-to-dealer advisories which identify known premature or
oddball problems. (for example, my mom's '99 Caddy STS had a free valve
job done on its Northstar 32 Valve V8 at 120,000km...big
cash!...because of a Service Memo I tracked down online).

As for the stealer, er, I mean dealer...factory-authorized warranty
jobs pay Top Dollar my friend...I haven't met a dealer yet that doesn't
want to find a way to get the factory to pay full pop for a nice payday
like an Audi clutch. That's my way of saying there's nothing in it for
the dealer to try and get you to pay for it if they can get the factory
cash in their hands....unless they plan on double-dipping and getting
money from you and the factory, but that's risky business, as a dealer
can lose its franchise if it gets caught doing fraudulent warranty
claims....

So unless your dealer is exceptionally well-known as a weaselarium or
you've heard rumours they're about to go under, I'd tend to steer
towards getting the dealer to involve your Zone/Regional Audi office in
the teardown...or call them yourself....manufacturers such as Audi have
people on the road that inspect unusual or pricey potential warranty
claims and make fair rulings in my experience. Plus, having the Zone
rep involved will keep the dealer honest.

My wierdest clutch experience:

In the early 1980's I went through a Renault Phase and after owning an
R5 GTL and an Encore, I bought a 2 year old Fuego Turbo from a Ford
dealer....and paid extra to get the Ford Red Carpet Used Car
Warranty...because I knew Fuegos were cool, but extremely nasty cars to
repair.

The clutch started slipping within a week....no problem, they changed
it no charge.

A month later, it went again. They changed it, no problem, no charge.

A few months later, I picked it up with Clutch #5 in it and got 10
minutes away from the dealership, hit the highway, put it in fourth at
about 4500 RPM and jumped on the gas to get the big Garrett T3 to blast
off.....wheeeeeeeeee.....clutch gone again.

The dealer then told me I obviously was "racing" and "abusing" the
car....in ten minutes!

Long story cut short....the Ford Zone Rep gave me a bag of cash to make
me go away.

Turned out it was a cracked bell housing leaking fluid on the clutch
material.

Maybe your transmission case has a hairline crack...if so, your clutch
material will be wet.

Good luck!

winston

Here's what I think you ought to consider in terms of variables and
taking control of this particular situation...

Assuming you bought the car new and the warranty is a new car warranty,
it will be unlikely that a worn out clutch will be covered under
warranty, because (read your fine print to check on this) "wear items"
like tires, clutch and brake linings are not usually covered by car
manufacturer warranties.

If your clutch has simply worn out after 38K that's surely odd...but
hey, maybe you're riding the clutch and you sent it to an early
grave...obviously nobody here can say one way or the other. My 87 5ktq
has 250K on the original clutch and it's solid...my BMW 3 series took
220K of whipping, and I mean a daily thrashing, by me before it toasted
not the lining, but the throw bearing.....German cars have very good
clutches, so you're either riding the clutch, abusing it, or it's
defective. Common sense says it's 1 of those 3 possibilities.

The 2 usual exceptions to the general rule in new car Warranty coverage
that will get your clutch fixed for free are:

1. manufacturers defects; and

2. the existence of "service memos", those semi-secret
manufacturer-to-dealer advisories which identify known premature or
oddball problems. (for example, my mom's '99 Caddy STS had a free valve
job done on its Northstar 32 Valve V8 at 120,000km...big
cash!...because of a Service Memo I tracked down online).

As for the stealer, er, I mean dealer...factory-authorized warranty
jobs pay Top Dollar my friend...I haven't met a dealer yet that doesn't
want to find a way to get the factory to pay full pop for a nice payday
like an Audi clutch. That's my way of saying there's nothing in it for
the dealer to try and get you to pay for it if they can get the factory
cash in their hands....unless they plan on double-dipping and getting
money from you and the factory, but that's risky business, as a dealer
can lose its franchise if it gets caught doing fraudulent warranty
claims....

So unless your dealer is exceptionally well-known as a weaselarium or
you've heard rumours they're about to go under, I'd tend to steer
towards getting the dealer to involve your Zone/Regional Audi office in
the teardown...or call them yourself....manufacturers such as Audi have
people on the road that inspect unusual or pricey potential warranty
claims and make fair rulings in my experience. Plus, having the Zone
rep involved will keep the dealer honest.

My wierdest clutch experience:

In the early 1980's I went through a Renault Phase and after owning an
R5 GTL and an Encore, I bought a 2 year old Fuego Turbo from a Ford
dealer....and paid extra to get the Ford Red Carpet Used Car
Warranty...because I knew Fuegos were cool, but extremely nasty cars to
repair.

The clutch started slipping within a week....no problem, they changed
it no charge.

A month later, it went again. They changed it, no problem, no charge.

A few months later, I picked it up with Clutch #5 in it and got 10
minutes away from the dealership, hit the highway, put it in fourth at
about 4500 RPM and jumped on the gas to get the big Garrett T3 to blast
off.....wheeeeeeeeee.....clutch gone again.

The dealer then told me I obviously was "racing" and "abusing" the
car....in ten minutes!

Long story cut short....the Ford Zone Rep gave me a bag of cash to make
me go away.

Turned out it was a cracked bell housing leaking fluid on the clutch
material.

Maybe your transmission case has a hairline crack...if so, your clutch
material will be wet.

Good luck!

Peter Bell

In message <1146712838.262456.161640@v46g2000cwv.googlegroups .com>
"winston" <winstoncole@yahoo.com> wrote:

> If your clutch has simply worn out after 38K that's surely odd...but
> hey, maybe you're riding the clutch and you sent it to an early
> grave...obviously nobody here can say one way or the other.

My guess is that the clutch is being abused. The original post talked
about changing gear slowly - now I guess that this doesn't mean moving
the gear stick slowly. More likely, the driver is keeping the engine
revs high and letting the clutch engage slowly, with lots of slip -
whilst being kind to the rest of the transmission, this will result in
excessive wear of the clutch plate, particularly in the town traffic he
describes.

--
Peter Bell (Note Spamtrap - To reply, replace 'invalid' with 'bellfamily')

Peter Bell

In message <1146712838.262456.161640@v46g2000cwv.googlegroups .com>
"winston" <winstoncole@yahoo.com> wrote:

> If your clutch has simply worn out after 38K that's surely odd...but
> hey, maybe you're riding the clutch and you sent it to an early
> grave...obviously nobody here can say one way or the other.

My guess is that the clutch is being abused. The original post talked
about changing gear slowly - now I guess that this doesn't mean moving
the gear stick slowly. More likely, the driver is keeping the engine
revs high and letting the clutch engage slowly, with lots of slip -
whilst being kind to the rest of the transmission, this will result in
excessive wear of the clutch plate, particularly in the town traffic he
describes.

--
Peter Bell (Note Spamtrap - To reply, replace 'invalid' with 'bellfamily')

Peter Bell

In message <1146712838.262456.161640@v46g2000cwv.googlegroups .com>
"winston" <winstoncole@yahoo.com> wrote:

> If your clutch has simply worn out after 38K that's surely odd...but
> hey, maybe you're riding the clutch and you sent it to an early
> grave...obviously nobody here can say one way or the other.

My guess is that the clutch is being abused. The original post talked
about changing gear slowly - now I guess that this doesn't mean moving
the gear stick slowly. More likely, the driver is keeping the engine
revs high and letting the clutch engage slowly, with lots of slip -
whilst being kind to the rest of the transmission, this will result in
excessive wear of the clutch plate, particularly in the town traffic he
describes.

--
Peter Bell (Note Spamtrap - To reply, replace 'invalid' with 'bellfamily')