OPINION:Quality and Passion Declining in European Automakers
#11
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: OPINION:Quality and Passion Declining in European Automakers
Worst thing I did was to buy a Z3.
US manufactured with burrs under the hood and everywhere there's an edge.
Hoses too short to fit with the nipples, Inverted wheels (V drawingd turned
towards the rear !!!)
Fortunately Other Bimmers are made in Europe.
I had same of experience with rental Neons and Chryslers some years ago.
Finished like crap and crap they are. Definitely.
Regards
"CaptainW116" <benznut450@yahoo.com> a écrit dans le message news:
1122972399.460051.25020@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.c om...
> (please note;this is crossposted to Mercedes,BMW,Jaguar,Audi and
> Volvo)Although I am a fan of 70s' and 80s' European automobiles,I can
> not help notice this trend all across the board!Rust on new Mercedes
> and BMW,plastic on the exteriors of Volvo,and so on.......Who do you
> see as the dominate automaker,say,10 years from now?What is a realistic
> life expectancy of 2000 and newer European automobile and are you truly
> happy with your purchase(do you feel cheated)?In your opinion,what
> item(s)need to be done away with or improved?Hopefully,all those whom
> respond understand that it is not my intention to start a bash war,just
> want to hear opinions from fellow European automotive enthusiast!
>
US manufactured with burrs under the hood and everywhere there's an edge.
Hoses too short to fit with the nipples, Inverted wheels (V drawingd turned
towards the rear !!!)
Fortunately Other Bimmers are made in Europe.
I had same of experience with rental Neons and Chryslers some years ago.
Finished like crap and crap they are. Definitely.
Regards
"CaptainW116" <benznut450@yahoo.com> a écrit dans le message news:
1122972399.460051.25020@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.c om...
> (please note;this is crossposted to Mercedes,BMW,Jaguar,Audi and
> Volvo)Although I am a fan of 70s' and 80s' European automobiles,I can
> not help notice this trend all across the board!Rust on new Mercedes
> and BMW,plastic on the exteriors of Volvo,and so on.......Who do you
> see as the dominate automaker,say,10 years from now?What is a realistic
> life expectancy of 2000 and newer European automobile and are you truly
> happy with your purchase(do you feel cheated)?In your opinion,what
> item(s)need to be done away with or improved?Hopefully,all those whom
> respond understand that it is not my intention to start a bash war,just
> want to hear opinions from fellow European automotive enthusiast!
>
#12
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: OPINION:Quality and Passion Declining in European Automakers
Worst thing I did was to buy a Z3.
US manufactured with burrs under the hood and everywhere there's an edge.
Hoses too short to fit with the nipples, Inverted wheels (V drawingd turned
towards the rear !!!)
Fortunately Other Bimmers are made in Europe.
I had same of experience with rental Neons and Chryslers some years ago.
Finished like crap and crap they are. Definitely.
Regards
"CaptainW116" <benznut450@yahoo.com> a écrit dans le message news:
1122972399.460051.25020@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.c om...
> (please note;this is crossposted to Mercedes,BMW,Jaguar,Audi and
> Volvo)Although I am a fan of 70s' and 80s' European automobiles,I can
> not help notice this trend all across the board!Rust on new Mercedes
> and BMW,plastic on the exteriors of Volvo,and so on.......Who do you
> see as the dominate automaker,say,10 years from now?What is a realistic
> life expectancy of 2000 and newer European automobile and are you truly
> happy with your purchase(do you feel cheated)?In your opinion,what
> item(s)need to be done away with or improved?Hopefully,all those whom
> respond understand that it is not my intention to start a bash war,just
> want to hear opinions from fellow European automotive enthusiast!
>
US manufactured with burrs under the hood and everywhere there's an edge.
Hoses too short to fit with the nipples, Inverted wheels (V drawingd turned
towards the rear !!!)
Fortunately Other Bimmers are made in Europe.
I had same of experience with rental Neons and Chryslers some years ago.
Finished like crap and crap they are. Definitely.
Regards
"CaptainW116" <benznut450@yahoo.com> a écrit dans le message news:
1122972399.460051.25020@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.c om...
> (please note;this is crossposted to Mercedes,BMW,Jaguar,Audi and
> Volvo)Although I am a fan of 70s' and 80s' European automobiles,I can
> not help notice this trend all across the board!Rust on new Mercedes
> and BMW,plastic on the exteriors of Volvo,and so on.......Who do you
> see as the dominate automaker,say,10 years from now?What is a realistic
> life expectancy of 2000 and newer European automobile and are you truly
> happy with your purchase(do you feel cheated)?In your opinion,what
> item(s)need to be done away with or improved?Hopefully,all those whom
> respond understand that it is not my intention to start a bash war,just
> want to hear opinions from fellow European automotive enthusiast!
>
#13
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: OPINION:Quality and Passion Declining in European Automakers
Worst thing I did was to buy a Z3.
US manufactured with burrs under the hood and everywhere there's an edge.
Hoses too short to fit with the nipples, Inverted wheels (V drawingd turned
towards the rear !!!)
Fortunately Other Bimmers are made in Europe.
I had same of experience with rental Neons and Chryslers some years ago.
Finished like crap and crap they are. Definitely.
Regards
"CaptainW116" <benznut450@yahoo.com> a écrit dans le message news:
1122972399.460051.25020@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.c om...
> (please note;this is crossposted to Mercedes,BMW,Jaguar,Audi and
> Volvo)Although I am a fan of 70s' and 80s' European automobiles,I can
> not help notice this trend all across the board!Rust on new Mercedes
> and BMW,plastic on the exteriors of Volvo,and so on.......Who do you
> see as the dominate automaker,say,10 years from now?What is a realistic
> life expectancy of 2000 and newer European automobile and are you truly
> happy with your purchase(do you feel cheated)?In your opinion,what
> item(s)need to be done away with or improved?Hopefully,all those whom
> respond understand that it is not my intention to start a bash war,just
> want to hear opinions from fellow European automotive enthusiast!
>
US manufactured with burrs under the hood and everywhere there's an edge.
Hoses too short to fit with the nipples, Inverted wheels (V drawingd turned
towards the rear !!!)
Fortunately Other Bimmers are made in Europe.
I had same of experience with rental Neons and Chryslers some years ago.
Finished like crap and crap they are. Definitely.
Regards
"CaptainW116" <benznut450@yahoo.com> a écrit dans le message news:
1122972399.460051.25020@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.c om...
> (please note;this is crossposted to Mercedes,BMW,Jaguar,Audi and
> Volvo)Although I am a fan of 70s' and 80s' European automobiles,I can
> not help notice this trend all across the board!Rust on new Mercedes
> and BMW,plastic on the exteriors of Volvo,and so on.......Who do you
> see as the dominate automaker,say,10 years from now?What is a realistic
> life expectancy of 2000 and newer European automobile and are you truly
> happy with your purchase(do you feel cheated)?In your opinion,what
> item(s)need to be done away with or improved?Hopefully,all those whom
> respond understand that it is not my intention to start a bash war,just
> want to hear opinions from fellow European automotive enthusiast!
>
#14
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: OPINION:Quality and Passion Declining in European Automakers
Just bought my wife a new X-Type 2.0 V6 SE Auto which kind of tells you
which camp I'm in, but we took a long time trying all relevant models in
this price range.
My wife doesn't like (or wants to pay) for powerful big engines, so we were
looking at all the smaller engined models which narrows down your choice and
makes you concentrate on other points of the vehicle.
Our final choice came down to the X-Type, a Merc C180K AMG saloon and the
Lexus IS200. We liked the outside desgin of the Merc, the quality and
equipment of the Lexus but the Jag won overall on quality of interior,
options and price.
We're delighted, it isn't exactly a quick car, but that's not what we were
buying, but it makes us feel we're driving a car that cost twice what it
actually did.
Alan M
www.atstone.co.uk
> "CaptainW116" <benznut450@yahoo.com> a écrit dans le message news:
> 1122972399.460051.25020@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.c om...
>> (please note;this is crossposted to Mercedes,BMW,Jaguar,Audi and
>> Volvo)Although I am a fan of 70s' and 80s' European automobiles,I can
>> not help notice this trend all across the board!Rust on new Mercedes
>> and BMW,plastic on the exteriors of Volvo,and so on.......Who do you
>> see as the dominate automaker,say,10 years from now?What is a realistic
>> life expectancy of 2000 and newer European automobile and are you truly
>> happy with your purchase(do you feel cheated)?In your opinion,what
>> item(s)need to be done away with or improved?Hopefully,all those whom
>> respond understand that it is not my intention to start a bash war,just
>> want to hear opinions from fellow European automotive enthusiast!
>>
>
>
which camp I'm in, but we took a long time trying all relevant models in
this price range.
My wife doesn't like (or wants to pay) for powerful big engines, so we were
looking at all the smaller engined models which narrows down your choice and
makes you concentrate on other points of the vehicle.
Our final choice came down to the X-Type, a Merc C180K AMG saloon and the
Lexus IS200. We liked the outside desgin of the Merc, the quality and
equipment of the Lexus but the Jag won overall on quality of interior,
options and price.
We're delighted, it isn't exactly a quick car, but that's not what we were
buying, but it makes us feel we're driving a car that cost twice what it
actually did.
Alan M
www.atstone.co.uk
> "CaptainW116" <benznut450@yahoo.com> a écrit dans le message news:
> 1122972399.460051.25020@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.c om...
>> (please note;this is crossposted to Mercedes,BMW,Jaguar,Audi and
>> Volvo)Although I am a fan of 70s' and 80s' European automobiles,I can
>> not help notice this trend all across the board!Rust on new Mercedes
>> and BMW,plastic on the exteriors of Volvo,and so on.......Who do you
>> see as the dominate automaker,say,10 years from now?What is a realistic
>> life expectancy of 2000 and newer European automobile and are you truly
>> happy with your purchase(do you feel cheated)?In your opinion,what
>> item(s)need to be done away with or improved?Hopefully,all those whom
>> respond understand that it is not my intention to start a bash war,just
>> want to hear opinions from fellow European automotive enthusiast!
>>
>
>
#15
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: OPINION:Quality and Passion Declining in European Automakers
Just bought my wife a new X-Type 2.0 V6 SE Auto which kind of tells you
which camp I'm in, but we took a long time trying all relevant models in
this price range.
My wife doesn't like (or wants to pay) for powerful big engines, so we were
looking at all the smaller engined models which narrows down your choice and
makes you concentrate on other points of the vehicle.
Our final choice came down to the X-Type, a Merc C180K AMG saloon and the
Lexus IS200. We liked the outside desgin of the Merc, the quality and
equipment of the Lexus but the Jag won overall on quality of interior,
options and price.
We're delighted, it isn't exactly a quick car, but that's not what we were
buying, but it makes us feel we're driving a car that cost twice what it
actually did.
Alan M
www.atstone.co.uk
> "CaptainW116" <benznut450@yahoo.com> a écrit dans le message news:
> 1122972399.460051.25020@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.c om...
>> (please note;this is crossposted to Mercedes,BMW,Jaguar,Audi and
>> Volvo)Although I am a fan of 70s' and 80s' European automobiles,I can
>> not help notice this trend all across the board!Rust on new Mercedes
>> and BMW,plastic on the exteriors of Volvo,and so on.......Who do you
>> see as the dominate automaker,say,10 years from now?What is a realistic
>> life expectancy of 2000 and newer European automobile and are you truly
>> happy with your purchase(do you feel cheated)?In your opinion,what
>> item(s)need to be done away with or improved?Hopefully,all those whom
>> respond understand that it is not my intention to start a bash war,just
>> want to hear opinions from fellow European automotive enthusiast!
>>
>
>
which camp I'm in, but we took a long time trying all relevant models in
this price range.
My wife doesn't like (or wants to pay) for powerful big engines, so we were
looking at all the smaller engined models which narrows down your choice and
makes you concentrate on other points of the vehicle.
Our final choice came down to the X-Type, a Merc C180K AMG saloon and the
Lexus IS200. We liked the outside desgin of the Merc, the quality and
equipment of the Lexus but the Jag won overall on quality of interior,
options and price.
We're delighted, it isn't exactly a quick car, but that's not what we were
buying, but it makes us feel we're driving a car that cost twice what it
actually did.
Alan M
www.atstone.co.uk
> "CaptainW116" <benznut450@yahoo.com> a écrit dans le message news:
> 1122972399.460051.25020@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.c om...
>> (please note;this is crossposted to Mercedes,BMW,Jaguar,Audi and
>> Volvo)Although I am a fan of 70s' and 80s' European automobiles,I can
>> not help notice this trend all across the board!Rust on new Mercedes
>> and BMW,plastic on the exteriors of Volvo,and so on.......Who do you
>> see as the dominate automaker,say,10 years from now?What is a realistic
>> life expectancy of 2000 and newer European automobile and are you truly
>> happy with your purchase(do you feel cheated)?In your opinion,what
>> item(s)need to be done away with or improved?Hopefully,all those whom
>> respond understand that it is not my intention to start a bash war,just
>> want to hear opinions from fellow European automotive enthusiast!
>>
>
>
#16
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: OPINION:Quality and Passion Declining in European Automakers
Just bought my wife a new X-Type 2.0 V6 SE Auto which kind of tells you
which camp I'm in, but we took a long time trying all relevant models in
this price range.
My wife doesn't like (or wants to pay) for powerful big engines, so we were
looking at all the smaller engined models which narrows down your choice and
makes you concentrate on other points of the vehicle.
Our final choice came down to the X-Type, a Merc C180K AMG saloon and the
Lexus IS200. We liked the outside desgin of the Merc, the quality and
equipment of the Lexus but the Jag won overall on quality of interior,
options and price.
We're delighted, it isn't exactly a quick car, but that's not what we were
buying, but it makes us feel we're driving a car that cost twice what it
actually did.
Alan M
www.atstone.co.uk
> "CaptainW116" <benznut450@yahoo.com> a écrit dans le message news:
> 1122972399.460051.25020@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.c om...
>> (please note;this is crossposted to Mercedes,BMW,Jaguar,Audi and
>> Volvo)Although I am a fan of 70s' and 80s' European automobiles,I can
>> not help notice this trend all across the board!Rust on new Mercedes
>> and BMW,plastic on the exteriors of Volvo,and so on.......Who do you
>> see as the dominate automaker,say,10 years from now?What is a realistic
>> life expectancy of 2000 and newer European automobile and are you truly
>> happy with your purchase(do you feel cheated)?In your opinion,what
>> item(s)need to be done away with or improved?Hopefully,all those whom
>> respond understand that it is not my intention to start a bash war,just
>> want to hear opinions from fellow European automotive enthusiast!
>>
>
>
which camp I'm in, but we took a long time trying all relevant models in
this price range.
My wife doesn't like (or wants to pay) for powerful big engines, so we were
looking at all the smaller engined models which narrows down your choice and
makes you concentrate on other points of the vehicle.
Our final choice came down to the X-Type, a Merc C180K AMG saloon and the
Lexus IS200. We liked the outside desgin of the Merc, the quality and
equipment of the Lexus but the Jag won overall on quality of interior,
options and price.
We're delighted, it isn't exactly a quick car, but that's not what we were
buying, but it makes us feel we're driving a car that cost twice what it
actually did.
Alan M
www.atstone.co.uk
> "CaptainW116" <benznut450@yahoo.com> a écrit dans le message news:
> 1122972399.460051.25020@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.c om...
>> (please note;this is crossposted to Mercedes,BMW,Jaguar,Audi and
>> Volvo)Although I am a fan of 70s' and 80s' European automobiles,I can
>> not help notice this trend all across the board!Rust on new Mercedes
>> and BMW,plastic on the exteriors of Volvo,and so on.......Who do you
>> see as the dominate automaker,say,10 years from now?What is a realistic
>> life expectancy of 2000 and newer European automobile and are you truly
>> happy with your purchase(do you feel cheated)?In your opinion,what
>> item(s)need to be done away with or improved?Hopefully,all those whom
>> respond understand that it is not my intention to start a bash war,just
>> want to hear opinions from fellow European automotive enthusiast!
>>
>
>
#17
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: OPINION:Quality and Passion Declining in European Automakers
thor wrote:
> Worst thing I did was to buy a Z3.
> US manufactured with burrs under the hood and everywhere there's an edge.
> Hoses too short to fit with the nipples, Inverted wheels (V drawingd turned
> towards the rear !!!)
>
> Fortunately Other Bimmers are made in Europe.
>
> I had same of experience with rental Neons and Chryslers some years ago.
> Finished like crap and crap they are. Definitely.
>
> Regards
I can second that.
I had mine for 3 months before selling it because I was fed up with
the problems..from new I had leaky roof, stereo kept switching itself
off, gear stick fell to pieces, ocasionally it just refused to start -
to name a few! The finish on some of the car was less than you would
have expected from a BMW to say the least. Even a BMW dealer I talked
to afterwards agreed it was not a very well made car.
The problem is that people won't accept paying such huge premiums for
the quality now that they used to - especially as the competition is so
close - if not better in some cases. If you look at (in particular)
German cars of old you used to get fantastic build, but very little
in the way of equipment. But now everyone wants all the gadgets - at
the same price! so something has to give, and it has been the quality.
Matt.
> Worst thing I did was to buy a Z3.
> US manufactured with burrs under the hood and everywhere there's an edge.
> Hoses too short to fit with the nipples, Inverted wheels (V drawingd turned
> towards the rear !!!)
>
> Fortunately Other Bimmers are made in Europe.
>
> I had same of experience with rental Neons and Chryslers some years ago.
> Finished like crap and crap they are. Definitely.
>
> Regards
I can second that.
I had mine for 3 months before selling it because I was fed up with
the problems..from new I had leaky roof, stereo kept switching itself
off, gear stick fell to pieces, ocasionally it just refused to start -
to name a few! The finish on some of the car was less than you would
have expected from a BMW to say the least. Even a BMW dealer I talked
to afterwards agreed it was not a very well made car.
The problem is that people won't accept paying such huge premiums for
the quality now that they used to - especially as the competition is so
close - if not better in some cases. If you look at (in particular)
German cars of old you used to get fantastic build, but very little
in the way of equipment. But now everyone wants all the gadgets - at
the same price! so something has to give, and it has been the quality.
Matt.
#18
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: OPINION:Quality and Passion Declining in European Automakers
thor wrote:
> Worst thing I did was to buy a Z3.
> US manufactured with burrs under the hood and everywhere there's an edge.
> Hoses too short to fit with the nipples, Inverted wheels (V drawingd turned
> towards the rear !!!)
>
> Fortunately Other Bimmers are made in Europe.
>
> I had same of experience with rental Neons and Chryslers some years ago.
> Finished like crap and crap they are. Definitely.
>
> Regards
I can second that.
I had mine for 3 months before selling it because I was fed up with
the problems..from new I had leaky roof, stereo kept switching itself
off, gear stick fell to pieces, ocasionally it just refused to start -
to name a few! The finish on some of the car was less than you would
have expected from a BMW to say the least. Even a BMW dealer I talked
to afterwards agreed it was not a very well made car.
The problem is that people won't accept paying such huge premiums for
the quality now that they used to - especially as the competition is so
close - if not better in some cases. If you look at (in particular)
German cars of old you used to get fantastic build, but very little
in the way of equipment. But now everyone wants all the gadgets - at
the same price! so something has to give, and it has been the quality.
Matt.
> Worst thing I did was to buy a Z3.
> US manufactured with burrs under the hood and everywhere there's an edge.
> Hoses too short to fit with the nipples, Inverted wheels (V drawingd turned
> towards the rear !!!)
>
> Fortunately Other Bimmers are made in Europe.
>
> I had same of experience with rental Neons and Chryslers some years ago.
> Finished like crap and crap they are. Definitely.
>
> Regards
I can second that.
I had mine for 3 months before selling it because I was fed up with
the problems..from new I had leaky roof, stereo kept switching itself
off, gear stick fell to pieces, ocasionally it just refused to start -
to name a few! The finish on some of the car was less than you would
have expected from a BMW to say the least. Even a BMW dealer I talked
to afterwards agreed it was not a very well made car.
The problem is that people won't accept paying such huge premiums for
the quality now that they used to - especially as the competition is so
close - if not better in some cases. If you look at (in particular)
German cars of old you used to get fantastic build, but very little
in the way of equipment. But now everyone wants all the gadgets - at
the same price! so something has to give, and it has been the quality.
Matt.
#19
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: OPINION:Quality and Passion Declining in European Automakers
thor wrote:
> Worst thing I did was to buy a Z3.
> US manufactured with burrs under the hood and everywhere there's an edge.
> Hoses too short to fit with the nipples, Inverted wheels (V drawingd turned
> towards the rear !!!)
>
> Fortunately Other Bimmers are made in Europe.
>
> I had same of experience with rental Neons and Chryslers some years ago.
> Finished like crap and crap they are. Definitely.
>
> Regards
I can second that.
I had mine for 3 months before selling it because I was fed up with
the problems..from new I had leaky roof, stereo kept switching itself
off, gear stick fell to pieces, ocasionally it just refused to start -
to name a few! The finish on some of the car was less than you would
have expected from a BMW to say the least. Even a BMW dealer I talked
to afterwards agreed it was not a very well made car.
The problem is that people won't accept paying such huge premiums for
the quality now that they used to - especially as the competition is so
close - if not better in some cases. If you look at (in particular)
German cars of old you used to get fantastic build, but very little
in the way of equipment. But now everyone wants all the gadgets - at
the same price! so something has to give, and it has been the quality.
Matt.
> Worst thing I did was to buy a Z3.
> US manufactured with burrs under the hood and everywhere there's an edge.
> Hoses too short to fit with the nipples, Inverted wheels (V drawingd turned
> towards the rear !!!)
>
> Fortunately Other Bimmers are made in Europe.
>
> I had same of experience with rental Neons and Chryslers some years ago.
> Finished like crap and crap they are. Definitely.
>
> Regards
I can second that.
I had mine for 3 months before selling it because I was fed up with
the problems..from new I had leaky roof, stereo kept switching itself
off, gear stick fell to pieces, ocasionally it just refused to start -
to name a few! The finish on some of the car was less than you would
have expected from a BMW to say the least. Even a BMW dealer I talked
to afterwards agreed it was not a very well made car.
The problem is that people won't accept paying such huge premiums for
the quality now that they used to - especially as the competition is so
close - if not better in some cases. If you look at (in particular)
German cars of old you used to get fantastic build, but very little
in the way of equipment. But now everyone wants all the gadgets - at
the same price! so something has to give, and it has been the quality.
Matt.
#20
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: OPINION:Quality and Passion Declining in European Automakers
On Tue, 02 Aug 2005 22:23:31 GMT, Benjamin Smith <benjs@ix.netcom.com>
wrote:
>I like the Saab 3, but the other Saabs are questionable. I hope this
>very individual brand gets back to being unique, but I'm not counting on
>GM to keep it this way. Losing the hatchback loses at lot of
>individuality and carrying capacity.
The loss of the hatchback is what drove me away but the new Aero Combi
give me hope that the original Saab philosophy may not be gone
forever.
Kal
wrote:
>I like the Saab 3, but the other Saabs are questionable. I hope this
>very individual brand gets back to being unique, but I'm not counting on
>GM to keep it this way. Losing the hatchback loses at lot of
>individuality and carrying capacity.
The loss of the hatchback is what drove me away but the new Aero Combi
give me hope that the original Saab philosophy may not be gone
forever.
Kal